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Sunday, November 04, 2012

Steelers-Giants game day thread

A lot has been made of the Steelers' travel today. I don't think their travel schedule affects this game any more than the Giants' issues with having players and their families displaced by Hurricane Sandy for much of the week.

Remember, the Giants were unable to do anything as a team until Wednesday. Injured players couldn't even really get treatment until then.

@ Here are the Steelers' inactives for today: Charlie Batch, Jonathan Dwyer, Rashard Mendenhall, Troy Polamalu, Stevenson Sylvester, Marcus Gilbert and Alameda Ta'amu


marc said...

obviously, it has already been determined NY is going to win this game. the ref calls so far border on criminal.

Anonymous said...

is there a point in watching this game? Goodell should have made the steelers play with 50lb lead weights in their shoes as well

adamg said...

Not still digging those regular refs, marc? :)

adamg said...

BR seems so anxious to get the ball to Wallace deep - a bad INT there, into double coverage.

Personally,imho, after being jobbed by the NFL and set up as patsies for P Manning's return and now for a feel good NYG win, the Rooneys should refuse to be scheduled for more than 1 or 2 primetime games in protest.

Patrick said...

this game is just annoying.

I feel like the Steelers kicked this team's ass in the first half, had calls not go their way and really fell out of synch in the 2nd half.

Frustrating game, I hope they pull it out - would be a big lift.

Patrick said...

can we fire Tomlin now?

Anonymous said...

yeah ok im glad i stuck around to watch it!

marc said...

adamg, no doubt. i am now under the premise that all refs suck and the regular refs are only more efficient at running the game.

kyle said...

Yes, Patrick, we (they) can fire Tomlin now. After beating a good team on the road after the refs hand the opposing team 14 points, you definitely fire the head coach because of a failed fake field goal.

I know you hate Tomlin. You work in cheap digs at him whenever possible. If you don't understand calculated risk then I don't know what to tell you. The Giants couldn't get a first down. That's why the Steelers pulled out the trick play. Would I have called it? Nope, but I would never call a fake field goal, so I don't really care. If he makes that call at the 50, that would be a huge mistake. At the 3, when your defense is shutting the Giants down? No big deal.

adamg said...

The officiating gave NYG 3 TDs, but the Steelers also did get a couple to their benefit with BR being called down instead of losing a fumble in the second half and also the one against NYG for lining up in the neutral zone that made a 3rd and 7, a 3rd and 2 on the winning TD drive.

The OL was outstanding. They were really bulldozing the DL off the ball in the run game. Fun to see the offense imposing their will. You can see how much the run blocking helps the pass blocking.

Patrick said...

that fake fg was such a bad call I can't even argue with you

let me just say this: if Suisham mishandles that ball , which is entirely possible, it could have ruined the game.

That call was right up there with Tice having Moss throw a pass in a big situation.

kyle said...

I said, I wouldn't have made that call. I never like a fake field goal or fake punt, unless they've shown you a glaring weakness and you exploit it. The thing with calls like this is everybody gets wrapped up in the result. If Suisham walks in for the touchdown then we would be hearing about it like when overrated Payton kicked onsides in the Super Bowl. I'm thinking of the circumstances. They were on the 3. The Giants offense was doing nothing. The consideration was most likely "go for it" or "fake field goal." As I said, I don't like the call but to pretend that it was anything more than a bad call is silly.

Oh, and is Tomlin still the worst at challenges? He shouldn't have had to challenge that terrible spot but it was still a good call, even though the Giants converted afterwards.

Patrick said...

If you defend Sean f'n Suisham running the ball in that situation, on 4th and inches, then you do that. Its a waste of time for me to argue you.

Its more than a bad call, its a terrible call.

And that challenge was goofy all around. First of all, you can't challenge forward progress, which is what the ref said he was challenging. But clearly, that ref is insane.

But it was an Andy Reid type challenge, because all he gained was a 3rd and inches that is a 90% conversion rate. So great, good, I'm so glad he won that one.

One day Tomlin is going to make a call like that fake FG that blows a game so bad (Ten comes to mind), that his judgment will have to be questioned.

The announcers even said it today: Tomlin said he goes on gut for decisions. If that iss the case, then the man doesn't think and that is blatantly obvious in some of the calls he has made. If you want to defend it, go ahead, but its blind loyalty.

Anonymous said...

Dale can we take a vote to ban the racist... Oops I mean Patrick?

ibygeorge said...

What a coincidence the commissioner was in town talking to the governors and mayors of the hurricane ravaged towns on how this game can be played without interfering with the recovery effort and all referee judgement calls went the Giants way.

Anonymous said...

He was right, right? In that situation you give your defense a CHANCE to make a play. What's the big deal?

John Kang said...

Refs tried to give the game to the Giants and we still got our signature victory for the season. D played four quarters lights out against a worthy opponent.

kyle said...

For the third time, I am not defending the call. It was a bad call. I don't like fake field goals or fake punts. You are taking the ball out of the hands of your playmakers. Even if the Steelers had scored a touchdown I would not have liked the call.

Also, what I'll repeat, because your blind hate apparently affects your reading comprehension, is that due to the circumstances (field position, Giants offensive ineptitude, Steelers defense playing well) it's not the worst call I've ever seen.

Is it worse than Belichick going for it on 4th down from his own 30 and losing the game?

Is it worse than Joe Gibbs double icing the kicker and getting a penalty called on him and losing the game?

Here's is the legitimate criticism - "Instead of kicking the tying field goal you went for it on 4th down with lesser personnel on the field." That does not make it the worst call ever, or of this season, or probably even of today (Jason Garrett currently coaching a game and all).

Whack said...

With every week, I am liking this Todd Haley offense more and more...

he definitely has a plan to use each and every one of our weapons... and it is making a difference with all of these injuries.

Patrick said...

so, in your mind, he deserves no criticism?

Give me a break. The circumstances dictate three choices. Its 4th and inches in a huge moment of the game: sneak it with your 250 lb QB, give it to your RB having a career day, or kick it. Thats it.

Anything else is stupid and needs to be criticized.

kyle said...

Where did I say he deserves no criticism? I said it was a bad call. I laid out (twice) why I think it was a bad call.

You weren't criticizing. You suggested he should be fired. You suggested it was a "terrible" call. You were making it seem like this was an historically bad call. That is what I disagree with - your histrionics.

Patrick said...

its a terrible call and if the steelers lost because of it, there would be 500 people writing about it on here.

It was THAT bad of a call and hes lucky it worked out for them.

You are happy they won and the defense held. You aren't thinking about the risks of putting the ball in your kicker's hands at the moment of the game.

kyle said...

I am thinking of the risk and the coaching staff thought of the risk. So, your criticism is that it was risky? Not that Suisham isn't the most athletic person for that?

I am happy they won. I'm not happy the defense held. The defense held. They had played very well up to that point and Tomlin trusted them to make a play if the gamble didn't pay off. He said himself after the game that the defense overcame a poor coaching decision.

It wasn't a terrible call. Trading a draft pick for the personal protector on punts is a terrible call. Trading your entire draft for Ricky Williams is a terrible call. Hiring Dave Shula instead of promoting Bill Walsh is a terrible call. Sure, these were all personnel decisions but in reality so was this call. Tomlin chose to go for it (which isn't a bad call) with the wrong personnel (which is a bad call). They were not in position to lose the game at that point unless they failed several more times. That is why it was not a "terrible" call.

Anonymous said...

Tomlin is a good player manager but a bad game manager.

The fake FG run was terrible.

He's a good coach but not beyond some criticism. Quit being such homers people.

Patrick said...

they were losing by 3, they were obviously in a position to lose the game.

kyle said...

The defense would have had to give up multiple first downs to lose at that point. Thus, they would have had to fail several more times for that one decision to cost them the game.

Patrick said...

if scoring is so automatic in your mind, then why are we discussing whether or not you should run a fake fg? they should go for it every 4th down, because if the defense doesn't fail, they'll score anyway right?

according to you, the steelers would have scored whenever they wanted. if the defense didn't fail, the steelers win! even though they were down by 3!

good logic

kyle said...

Nicely extrapolated. That is not at all what I said. I said they weren't in position to lose based on that call without multiple failures thereafter.

By your logic if they had been down my 3 in the first quarter and tried it they were in position to lose the game.

I don't get what the problem is here. I said it was a bad call. You're upset that I'm not "mad enough" or something?

Tomlin said in the post game press conference that it was a bad call but he made it because on the road in that position on the field going on a silent count he was concerned. I don't think that's reason enough to try a fake field goal. I don't like fake field goals. I also don't like silly hyperbole.

Patrick said...

the problem is Tomlin has a track record of poor calls.

Hes a Teflon Don though, never called out

Anonymous said...

That was a horrible call going for a fake fg.

Anyone who thinks otherwise is not intelligent

kyle said...

He's never called out? Every game story from a few weeks ago mentioned the 51 yard field goal attempt. Every game story tonight and tomorrow will include 3 things: the hurricane, the officiating, and the fake field goal (plus Redman but he will be most of the story).

Do you know why Tomlin doesn't get raked over the coals? Because he doesn't make himself the story the way Rex Ryan and the Harbaughs do. Also, because he has a few other track records: never finishing a season below .500, 2 Super Bowl appearances, a Super Bowl championship, winning the division 3 out of 5 years.

Winning shouldn't make you beyond reproach. And it doesn't. The fake was a bad call. The best defense anyone could muster is probably "it wasn't THAT bad." You can't have it both ways though, they can't lose because of him and win despite him. If they come out and play listless, it's on Tomlin. If they come out and play tough...Lebeau's still got it.

marc said...

patrick, why exactly do you want to fire tomlin?

because he makes 4-5 bad in-game decisions each season?


based on the totality of his work with the steelers?

just curious.

Anonymous said...

I don't see where anyone says they want to fire Tomlin.

marc said...

patrick's second post reads:

"can we fire Tomlin now?"

Patrick said...

I know I said "can we fire Tomlin now?" referring to the fake FG , but I wouldn't be a fan of firing a coach mid-season and hes obviously not going anywhere for awhile. It would probably take 3 bad seasons with 2 of them being atrocious for that to happen. And as long the current Steelers brass and Ben R are here, thats not happening.

So I won't use the "word" fire anymore.

To answer your question, its the totality of Tomlin. If you want me to go on about everything I dislike about him, then I will.