Tuesday, April 13, 2010

Internet speculation

I just did an interview with a radio station in St. Louis with Howard Balzer and he asked if I'd heard the trade rumor that had the Steelers shipping Ben Roethlisberger to the Rams for the No. 1 pick in the draft.

Balzer, a veteran reporter who I respect very much, said he asked a couple of Rams front office people about it and got no response from one, while the other replied, "That's interesting."

I don't know what that means, but if I'm the Steelers, I don't think I make that deal unless I'm positive that Roethlisberger's image is so damaged that it will never recover.

They'd also have to be in love with Sam Bradford, who will be the top pick in the draft, because he'd be their quarterback for the next 10 to 15 years.

At this point, it's all just internet speculation.

43 comments:

Benjamin said...

Maybe they'll make the trade, draft Suh and pick up Colt McCoy with their original 1st round pick.

No, I'm not serious.

Anonymous said...

Possibility... if Tomlin feels that locker room hates Ben, Its better Rooneys trade him away.

Anonymous said...

Why would they take Bradford in that situation? They can flush a pick on a system QB in round 2 by taking Tebow.

If they DID do a deal like that with St. Louis(and this apparently seems to be nothing more than a rumor running rampant after Ed Bouchette opined that the Rams 'would probably be interested if the Steelers wanted to trade him'), but if they DID do that deal and didn't draft Suh(or trade down) then they may as well just take about 80 million dollars out onto the 50 yard line at Heinz Field and set it on fire.

Cuz that's what you're talking about having to give Bradford....and I will certainly take whatever the under is on him ever winning a SB. And if he can't do that, then it's a complete waste of resources/a pick. Hell, behind the Steelers OL he'd probably last about a quarter of his first PS game. The guy is brittle.

If you're going to trade up to the 1st pick, you damn well better take the best player available. That isn't Sam Bradford.

Anonymous said...

What is up with all this Colt McCoy love anyway? Not just on this site, but in general.

The guy looks totally 'meh' as far as being a pro prospect goes to me. Totally locks onto receivers terrilby, doesn't step up to avoid pressure, etc etc. No thanks.

Anonymous said...

The Steelers wouldn't want anything to do with paying #1 overall money.

Dale Lolley said...

That was my first thought as well. You don't pay that kind of money to a player who may or may not become a good player.

Greg Mercer said...

that would be the stupidest trade ever!

Dale, what's your take on how the locker room feels about Ben?

surely, he can't be such damaged goods that they'd want him gone?

last time i checked, he wasn't convicted of anything.

Anonymous said...

What a terrible idea. There is no way that they should trade Ben. Two firsts, a second, and a third this year, and a first and third next year would be the minimum. The only team that could swing that would be the Seahawks (wouldn't that be funny- Ben on the Seahawks).

Ben is a once in a generation QB. Running him out of town for unsubstantiated allegations would be wrong. He has some personal problems- I think that we should support him and help him rehabilitate himself both on the field and in the community.

alexrkirby said...

I would rather trade for the #1, then trade down and get Clausen. The guy is much better at reading defenses and is tough.

Dale Lolley said...

I don't think the Steelers are at a cut-bait spot with Roethlisberger by any stretch. I was just throwing it out there because the St. Louis writer mentioned it.

alexrkirby said...

Maybe trade talk will be good for Ben, put a little fear in him if there wasn't enough already.

marc said...

would it really be that bad? 2 first round picks to solidfy our OL or pick up a stellar young defensive player.

i don't think they will do it, but i wouldn't be totally against it either.

Bob said...

It depends how serious the Rooneys are about cleaning up their image.

Also, between all the hits he takes, the concussions, his weight problem, decreased mobility, etc, and now his legal problems, the general opinion is that he won't have a very long career.

Should the Steelers consider moving him a little too early while he still has value, or wait until it's too late and they have to unload him for peanuts like they did Santonio?

It's an interesting debate. Santonio would have been worth at least a third rounder four weeks ago, but only a fifth rounder this week. The Steelers rolled the dice that he wouldn't continue to get in trouble, and they lost.

Dan said...

--would it really be that bad? 2 first round picks to solidfy our OL or pick up a stellar young defensive player--

2 OLmen to protect what? Charlie Batch?

We did the whole Great D crappy Offense thing in the 1990s- it didn't turn out that well.

marc said...

i'm not saying we would win the super bowl this year. but, i don't think we would completely fall apart either. if i remember correctly, the steelers were relatively successful in the 90's.

besides, great D and a strong run game brought us SB40. bring back the run game and all we need is a system QB anyway.

joseph said...

If we trade Ben this franchise is doomed to mediocrity for a decade or more. Elite QB's don't grow on trees, even if they are perverts.

Dan said...

--besides, great D and a strong run game brought us SB40. bring back the run game and all we need is a system QB anyway.--

The Steelers don't sniff Super Bowl XL without Roethlisberger. Do you think that they'd have made it with Maddox?

The power run, mediocre QB forumulation never won the Steelers anything.

Greg Mercer said...

dale,

do you think the players will rally around Ben or will they just act like nothing happened once he returns to practice?

Darren said...

Make that trade in a heartbeat. With all of these other so called rumors popping up over and over, Ben is not fit to wear Mr. Rooney's jersey.

Some of you 'It doesn't matter what he does/did. Win at all costs' people are truly pathetic. Have some pride.

Dale Lolley said...

Look, rumors are now going to pop up like crazy as any woman who's ever had relations with him is going to start looking for money. Doesn't mean anything. They are just that - rumors. The lawyer who spouted off Monday on Boston radio is already backtracking on his comments.

You don't give away a franchise QB, even one with a damaged rep - based on rumors.

As for his teammates, they'll deal with it. He is wildly popular among the boys anyway. They put up with him because he's a winner.
But that doesn't mean much, either. They don't have to like him. But they have to respect his ability.

marc said...

hey dan,
you need to stop drinking the cool aid man. that team was so good they should have won 2 or 3 super bowls. they were 15-1 the year before with a rookie QB who threw the ball less than 20 times per game.

he played within the system (also known as a "system QB") his second year. they limited his pass attempts, ran the ball 60% of the time, and relied on the defense. he had 2 surprising games in the playoffs before laying an egg in the super bowl. best pass that game came from El.

and you actually believe they don't sniff the super bowl without him? they almost lost the super bowl because of him.

Patrick said...

agree with marc here, but it would take a lot for me to want to trade Ben. The money to a #1 pick is just too much too.

But I do, in some odd throwback sense, like the idea of Dixon running the offense with a power running game and a strong D. Still, Ben is a top 5 QB, not worth a trade.

and just an FYI, I'm watching that I love you, man movie. Big Ben looks a lot like Jason Segal.

Anonymous said...

If I were trading for Ben it would have to be this year's number 1 and number 2 along with next years number 1. Probably not going to happen but I don't see giving up on Ben for anything less than that.

Anonymous said...

Dixon before he got hurt was the Heisman trophy winner and possibility the number one pick in that draft they got lucky getting him. Why do they need a QB.

joseph said...

We did not win a super bowl between Bradshaw and Big Ben. Those are the facts. The majority of recent Super Bowl Champs has an elite QB. WE won't win one with an avg. system QB. IMHO.

Dan said...

--Some of you 'It doesn't matter what he does/did. Win at all costs' people are truly pathetic. Have some pride.--

Darren,

Some of you "believe any rumor no matter how little evidence" people are truly pathetic. Have a little perspective.

Anonymous said...

I think all the Ben hating has really gotten out of hand.

The facts as I understand them are Ben had intimate contact with two women, one was sex (he admitted) and the other we're not sure.

Further than that it can't be proved that he's done anything wrong.

My guess is he hooked up with two girls and acted like a jerk to them afterwards.

He's guilty of being an idiot

So why blow up the team

Dan said...

hey dan,
you need to stop drinking the cool aid man. that team was so good they should have won 2 or 3 super bowls. they were 15-1 the year before with a rookie QB who threw the ball less than 20 times per game.
__________________________________

I'm not "drinking the kool-aid." If anything, you're buying into the myth of the unbeatable power run game and the Roethlisberger as game manager garbage.

Even in his rookie year Ben contributed with clutch, game winning drives (see the Dallas game, for example). The 2004 team was a run first team, though, and they finished with the predictable results (getting crushed in the AFCC, just like the past run heavy teams of the 90s and early 2000s). Taking 2 or 3 Super Bowl wins for granted is absurd. The problem with those teams is that they could never come from behind. Now, with Roethlisberger, we take it for granted that the Steelers can.

In 2005, Roethlisberger carried the Steelers through the playoffs. His performances against Indy and Denver were stunning. He had a bad Super Bowl to be sure, but you can't pretend that the prior games didn't happen. Ben even had some brilliant moments in the Super Bowl (see his 3rd and 28 completion to Ward). Besides, with the exception of Parker (another player Pittsburghers seem to love to hate), the offense didn't exactly have a great game. The defense was also spotty.

The bottom line is that Roethlisberger is a superb QB. Chasing him out of town because of unsubstantiated allegations would be ridiculous. McNulty is crazy, and in this GA case the DA said that there wasn't even probable cause (which is a fairly low bar to meet). Ben needs to grow up off the field- I don't see why he can't do the growing up as a member of the Steelers organization. Give the guy a chance to redeem himself.

Dan said...

Besides Mark, look at the Steelers 2005 record when Roethlisberger didn't start. They lost to Jacksonville and Baltimore with Tommy Maddox at the helm. Had Roethlisberger not been injured, then it's doubtful that the Steelers would have needed to run off a string of victories at the end of the season.

I can't believe how much some Steelers fans denigrate Roethlisberger's worth on the field. His value on the field is self evident to anyone not brainwashed into a "power run always wins" mentality. I'm a Bettis fan, and I believe that power running has its place, but it's not a formula for winning championships.

Chase Roethlisberger out of town and replace him with a true "system QB" or "game manager" and you'll see what your left with. I guarantee that you'll be singing a different tune.

marc said...

in 2005 they were 2-2 without #7. they then lost his first 2 games back before going on a 4 game win streak at the end of the year. during that streak the defense gave up an average of 8 points per game. during that streak he never completed more than 13 passes in a game. for the year he completed more than 18 passes only once, and he threw 3 INT's in that one. please, don't try to tell me he was some elite QB that took the team to the promised land. he was a system QB.


also, i guess you don't think #7's 3 INT's in the 2004 AFCC had anything to do with them getting crushed.

regardless, i never said we should trade him. i questioned if it would be a bad decision. i think we could build a strong enough team that a rising young QB could be successful and take us to a super bowl. oh, wait, we've already done that before.

btw, what's the inside of #7's butt look like anyway?

Chris said...

i think it's pretty evident that too many steelers fans have become almost too accustomed to the success the team has had lately. i think the appreciation has pretty much turned into an childish/unreasonable "anything-less-than-a-super-bowl-every-year-is-unacceptable" mentality. i like hearing those things from tomlin, but it sounds downright pathetic when it comes from a fan.

people are ready to fire tomlin and trade ben because "they don't fit with the 'true' steelers way." eat shit. they win. i admittedly have less allegiance to tomlin, but he's definitely a keeper for now. these bandwagon roethlisberger fans really, really don't deserve to have a top tier qb leading their favorite team. what they do deserve is nothing but kordell stewart/tommy maddox jerseys for christmas every year.

Anonymous said...

I agree that Ben was one of the biggest reasons they have won 2 SB's. Defense and Ben. I will never forget the 3 game stretch Ben had in the playoffs leading up to SB40. Ben has made plays in the most critical moments in playoff games and regular season games to help get the Steelers those SBs. Those are plays that no other QB on the Steelers roster at those times (or anyones roster possibly) could have made...3rd & 28? diving TD? The Tackle? The Denver game? The pass to Santonio? The SB43 last drive? The uncountable # of last minute comeback drives? I know I am forgetting alot also. He is easily the most important Steelers draft pick in the last 10 years if not longer...that being said, he is a d-bag.

Dan said...

--The uncountable # of last minute comeback drives?--

This is especially crucial. The pre-Roethlisberger Cowher playoff teams had real trouble coming from behind. I can only think of one playoff game off the top of my head (the 2002 Browns wildcard game) in which the Steelers won a game in which they were trailing in the second half.


Do you people seriously think any old system QB could step in and do what Roethlisberger did at the end of Super Bowl 43? Marc apparently thinks that Roethlisbergers grow on trees, and that any young "rising" QB can step in and do as good or better. Is that a common sentiment?

Dan said...

Plus, the number 1 pick in the draft might just neet you a "rising young QB" like David Carr or Alex Smith or Joey Harrington or Tim Couch etc.

Ben's a proven commodity. Trading him for the chance to draft someone who might pan out, but might become a huge bust, would be crazy. I don't see any reason to do so short of a criminal conviction.

Anonymous said...

Why don't you ask the Dolphins how easy it is to replace a franchise QB.

Anonymous said...

Anyone who truly believes the Steelers sniff that '05 SB without Roethlisberger is either just a goofus, has an agenda, or is suffering from dementia. Revisionist history doesn't change anything.

The offense in the playoff games leading up to that were little other than Roethlisberger throwing. Their running game had petered out. They moved the ball almost exclusively throw the air. They don't make that SB with Maddox/Stewart/fill in the blank at QB.

Anonymous said...

Ben is a dumbass who will never learn. He still rides his motorcycle without a helmet. One of the top QB's in the league no doubt. But he will not have a long career based on his off and on the field behavior. Get all you can for him now.

marc said...

i never said we should draft a QB with the number 1 pick.

revisionist history? if you don't remember what happened in 2005 season go look it up.

i never said any rising QB can do as good or better. i said they can be successful and possibly take the team to a super bowl with a strong team around them. there are many examples of that, not just #7.

you keep jumping back and forth between #7 when he was young and #7 now. there is no question, right now he is a superb QB. he was not a superb QB in his first couple years. they limited his attempts and thrived off of play-action pass plays because the run game was so good. if you don't agree with that then you are ignorant to football.

the run game petered out in the 2005 playoffs because the other teams stacked the box. #7 played very well, took advantage and torched them for it. seattle didn't stack the box, played more zone coverage, and #7 struggle mightily. then we torched them with 181 yards on the ground. that team was awesome.

can i definitely say we win SB40 without #7 - no. can you say we definitely don't make it to SB40 without #7 - no.

i'm very surprised at the reaction to this. i don't want to put words in someone's mouth, but it appears without #7 you feel this team is worthless. if anything, last season proved that having a top-notch QB doesn't even get you in the playoffs if you can't run or play good defense and ST's.

i'll leave it at that as i don't feel like beating a dead horse. we simply disagree.

Dan said...

--marc:

i'm very surprised at the reaction to this. i don't want to put words in someone's mouth, but it appears without #7 you feel this team is worthless. if anything, last season proved that having a top-notch QB doesn't even get you in the playoffs if you can't run or play good defense and ST's.--

I believe that the offense would more hapless without Ben than the defense was last year without Polamalu. Ben's abilities make this offense better than the sum of its parts. I doubt that any other QB could have won a Super Bowl with the low quality 2008-09 offensive line and running game.

Bring Polamalu back and replace Ben with a decent "game manager" and you'll get, at best, the Dolphins teams from the past few years. Ben can't win the Super Bowl by himself, but his presence transforms the team from also-rans into contenders. Getting rid of Ben would initiate a multi-year rebuilding program, because no other QB could make this mediocre offense work otherwise.

You're taking the media's position when it comes to Ben's role in the 2005 season. He was more than a mere systems QB. The Steelers passed heavily in the first half of games to establish the lead. Then, after the Steelers had secured the lead, the run game would take over and salt things away. Ben's stats from that year come almost entirely from the first half of the games. He rarely threw in the second.

Anonymous said...

"btw, what's the inside of #7's butt look like anyway?"

LOL

Anonymous said...

What Dan said.

His YPC in that season were also elite, meaning he did a lot in limited opportunities.

If the masses believe Tommy Maddox/Batch or some other 'game manager' could replicate that, then I would have to guess they never watched a single snap of Tommy Maddox's/Batch's/some other game manager's career.

Ben's a douchenozzle. There's really no way anyone can think otherwise at this point, but to opine this team would be better on the field if he were removed from the roster tomorrow, or 'able to be just fine with a Kyle Orton out there', is an understatement at the very best. It's closer to the realm of 'asinine.'

Anonymous said...

I don't agree with marc. They had a great team in the whole of the late 90's, lost three conference championship games and a Super Bowl; they had a great team during the beginning of the last decade and lost 2 conference championship games, then Big Ben arrived, and suddenly we win 2 out of 4 SB's.

I find it really hard to believe that we can win another one with a rookie QB, that does not happen very often. He has proven his value time and again, so what if he has off field issues (and as Dave said none of them have been proven and still remain rumors) and what else. He plays well, he is a bit of a drama queen, but wins, and wins more often than not.


I can't believe how judgmental people are these days, I mean give the guy a break he is not the pope, he is not the president, he is the QB, and a franchise one for that case, who has won 2 Super Bowls and is only 27 years old. And has done so, in a city that came close too often but had not won one in the last 25 years.

He has not been charged with anything, with anything at all, so what if he is a jerk, he wins and hasn't been convicted of anything. Nowadays that is a great plus.

Grow up and don't be such puritans. If Big Ben is traded to another team, Pro Football has become such a pansy ass sport, full of ballerinas and poster boys that I am not even sure I want to watch it anymore.

Mike said...

The Broncos just got two second-rounders for Brandon Marshall. Marshall is a better player than Santonio, but is every bit as big of a character risk.

Is 16 games of Brandon Marshall really worth that much more than 12 games of Santonio Holmes? In draft value terms, two 2nds have to worth at least ten times as much as one 5th.